Scaughdt:  Wow!  This thread is awesome – AND it has lost all semblance of focus. As such, here is a brief recap of a few still-unrefuted (and still mostly-unaddressed) facts:
*Fact:  God created homosexuality (i.e. IT IS NOT A “LIFESTYLE”) … Science is repeatedly showing that humans are one of over 1500+ species that have naturally occurring homosexual relationships in a minority of their pairings [see the mass of citations I offer for this Truth on pages 78-80 herein] … As such, if God is all-powerful & if God did create us humans, then God cannot fairly punish the “sin” of homosexuality – a “sin” that HE CREATED Himself!
*Fact:  It is cowardly to hide one’s own bigotry behind a bigoted God … Indeed, it shows a patent lack of integrity to blame God for “just making the rules”, … or to claim that gays actually “choose” to be damned for eternity, … or that Christians are to “love the sinner while hating (and condemning) the sin” … Indeed, to do any of these becomes a direct violation of everything Jesus Christ stood for in the Gospels.  It is weak to do so, it is immoral to do so, and it dishonors both Jesus & his Father to do so.
*Fact:  Matthew 7:1-5 (and Matthew 23:25-26 along with it) makes it very clear that no one — devout Christians included — should be opening their mouth to criticize the sins of anyone else … period!  Indeed, Jesus goes so far on a  number of occasions to state that to do otherwise makes one an arrogant hypocrite — two qualities that Jesus seemed to detest above all others.
*Fact:  Just as importantly, while both Leviticus 18:22 & Leviticus 20:13 are primitive verses that any true Follower of The Way of Christ must respectfully dismiss as being both immoral & ignorant, neither of these verses says that homosexuality itself is a sin; only that gay intercourse is … As such, if a gay pastor is celibate – or is in a gay relationship that is not sexually expressive – or even is in a homosexual relationship where sexual expressions are devoid of lust, then even by the Old Testament’s barbaric standards HE IS NOT SINNING!

 

*Fact:  Finally, to bring us back again to the picture that started all of this, we aren’t talking about a random gay couple here – or even homosexuals in general. We are talking about a gay Christian who happens to be an ordained minister of a Christian church.  The original question posed was:  Would you attend his services and listen to his sermons?  Nowhere in the Bible is there any prohibition against doing so.  As such, to refuse to do so simply on the grounds that he is gay is bigotry – and a direct affront to The Way of Jesus Christ to boot!

In closing, how fortunate for all Christians that there is an equally valid alternative available to you! … How blessed you are that you can remain a full-fledged Christian even after dismissing your judgmental, conservative, Paulinist beliefs! … How perfect the Grace of God that you are allowed right this instant to join Jesus Christ on his Way of selfless, unconditional Love instead!

 

It is not required that you do so, of course … It is rather a privilege that you are allowed to do so.  It is a Gift that has been freely given – a Gift that will be yours to accept & to cherish & to enliven for the rest of your lives; as fully or as little as you wish.

 

“Do not be afraid, little ones, for it is your Father’s good pleasure to freely give you the Kingdom.” ~ Jesus Christ (Luke 12.32)
Lucy:    [She gives a webpage link here – without commentary – to an article describing the story of a homosexual man who claims that God “made him straight.”]

Scaughdt:   (sigh) … That pretty much sums up the problem with “Christian news” – it is insulting to those having a different viewpoint & ignorant of any real understanding of the latest science [again, please refer to pages 78-80 above for a large listing of studies that have proven pretty conclusively that homosexuality is neither a “lifestyle” one adopts nor a “condition” one chooses voluntarily] … Lucy, it is not possible for anyone to simply “pray the gay away”, and it is flagrantly arrogant, patently bigoted (and somewhat immoral) of you to insinuate that anyone should do so even if they could!

 

 

Lucy:   Where is your faith, Scaughdt?!?

 

 

Scaughdt:   My Friend, my Faith is in The Way of Jesus Christ; a Way that I have tested for the last eleven+ years of my life and found to be consistent & powerful & true … Far more importantly, where is your humility, Lucy?  Why can’t you accept the fact that science is now showing that God made gays gay?  And why can’t you accept the fact that it is arrogant, hypocritical, bigoted and even unkind of you to single out gays and openly berate them for their sins?

[By the way, in case anyone out there is interested in the Truth about homosexuality, there is an excellently written and thoroughly researched Southern Poverty Law Center article to be found online (entitled “10 Anti-Gay Myths Debunked”) that gently illuminates and firmly extinguishes much of the ignorance surrounding the 10 most prevalent myths about homosexuality – including:  the myth that homosexuals are more likely to molest children (which is False), … the myth that same-sex parents harm their children (which is False), … the myth that people become homosexual because they were sexually abused as children &/or because they had poor same-sex role models (which are both False), … the myth that gay people are more prone to mental illness &/or that they are more likely to abuse drugs or alcohol (again, both False), … the myth that gay people are not born gay (which is False), … and the myth that gay people can choose to become straight (again – also False).]

 

 

*Bonus Fact:  Cherry-picking & then championing the more-hateful verses from the Bible is itself sinful … As this discussion alone has already clearly shown, there are a number of theological contradictions in the Bible; the most significant of which having to do with the very nature of God Himself; namely – is God a god of fear, judgment, condemnation & bigotry, or is God a GOD of Love, Acceptance, Grace & Forgiveness?
My Friends, Lucy can quote all the Old Testament oracles and all the professions of Paul and all the ramblings of Revelation she wants – she can quote them all to you and she can do so until the end of her days, and it won’t change the simple fact that another God exists within the pages of her own Bible – your own Bible; a God who loves all His creations; a God who forgives all our trespasses; a God who understands and adheres to (and indeed abides in) the perfect LOVE that was walked & talked by his own Son, Jesus Christ …

 

Essentially, all Christians out there have the following choice to make:  either worship a callous & capricious God of hateful (or at the very least capricious) judgment (and possibly spend a very uncomfortable eternity with Him after you die), or you can “become again as a child” and allow the humble, Kind, compassionate Love of Christ into your lives; by embracing the teachings of Jesus Christ and extending them to all the others around you — Democrats & “thugs” & gays alike, and thereby walk hand-in-hand with him into his Kingdom of Heaven right here on Earth!

 

Filed under: Burnishing Bigotry by Scaughdt